Mary worship in the Catholic Church

Apologetics
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In Catholic theology, Mary is revered as the “New Eve” (Latin: Nova Eva), a title highlighting her role in salvation history as the counterpart to Eve. However, the assertion that Catholics “worship through” her or that she was “baptized inside the Catholic Church” does not align with official Catholic teaching.

Just as Eve’s disobedience brought death, Mary’s obedience (“fiat”) at the Annunciation brought life. The Church teaches that Mary reversed the knot of disobedience tied by Eve through her unwavering faith and obedience, cooperating in the work of redemption alongside Christ, the “New Adam”.

Catholics do not worship Mary, which is a common misconception. Catholic doctrine explicitly states that worship (adoration/latria) is reserved for God alone (Father, Son, and Holy Spirit). Mary is given the highest form of honor or veneration, called hyperdulia, but she is not considered divine.

Catholics ask Mary to pray for them (intercession), not instead of God. She is viewed as a loving mother who brings humanity’s petitions to her Son, Jesus.

The Immaculate Conception, a central Catholic dogma, teaches that Mary was preserved from all stain of original sin from the first moment of her conception, which means she did not need the sacrament of baptism to wash away original sin.

All Marian devotions in the Catholic Church are intended to lead followers closer to Jesus.

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Difference is Jesus is prophesied in Isaiah 53. Going by “Isaiah 53:11” we can see what role he has in the afterlife. Thats the main difference

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I have said all I am going to say on the subject

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God bless you for your patience. May the Lord be with you

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Doesn’t that translate to. Prayers?

Intercessor i mean? Usually my parents pray for me. And i pray for them. That sort of thing

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Hebrews 13:8 Jesus Christ is the same yesterday and today and forever.,so it doesn’t matter much.

All intercessory prayers comes through different people,more so through the saints to top the list is the Mother of God, her office and dignity, since she is His beloved mother Mary most holy and immaculate ,He is quick to listen and answer as an example at the wedding at cana,we pray with our double dividend hearts, and oily tongues, Jesus so patiently waits and takes his time to answer.

Pax

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I believe in one God,
the Father almighty,
maker of heaven and earth,
of all things visible and invisible.

I believe in one Lord Jesus Christ,
the Only Begotten Son of God,
born of the Father before all ages.
God from God, Light from Light,
true God from true God,
begotten, not made, consubstantial with the Father;
through him all things were made.
For us men and for our salvation
he came down from heaven,
and by the Holy Spirit was incarnate of the Virgin Mary,
and became man.
For our sake he was crucified under Pontius Pilate,
he suffered death and was buried,
and rose again on the third day
in accordance with the Scriptures.
He ascended into heaven
and is seated at the right hand of the Father.
He will come again in glory
to judge the living and the dead
and his kingdom will have no end.

I believe in the Holy Spirit, the Lord, the giver of life,
who proceeds from the Father and the Son,
who with the Father and the Son is adored and glorified,
who has spoken through the prophets.

I believe in one, holy, catholic and apostolic Church.
I confess one Baptism for the forgiveness of sins
and I look forward to the resurrection of the dead
and the life of the world to come.

Amen.

Pax

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Mathew 28:18 And Jesus came and said to them, “All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. 19 Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 20 and teaching them to obey everything that I have commanded you. And remember, I am with you always, to the end of the age

John 2:5 His mother said to the servants, “Do whatever he tells you.”

Christ power and wisdom 1 Corinthians 1:26 Consider your own call, brothers and sisters: not many of you were wise by human standards,not many were powerful, not many were of noble birth. 27 But God chose what is foolish in the world to shame the wise; God chose what is weak in the world to shame the strong; 28 God chose what is low and despised in the world, things that are not, to reduce to nothing things that are, 29 so that no one might boast in the presence of God. 30 He is the source of your life in Christ Jesus, who became for us wisdom from God, and righteousness and sanctification and redemption, 31 in order that, as it is written, “Let the one who boasts, boast in the Lord.”

God freely chose Mary from all eternity to be the Mother of his Son. In order to carry out her mission she herself was conceived immaculate. This means that, thanks to the grace of God and in anticipation of the merits of Jesus Christ, Mary was preserved from original sin from the first instant of her conception.ccc

By the grace of God Mary was kept free from every personal sin her whole life long. She is the one who is “full of grace” (Lk 1:28), “the all holy”. When the angel announced to her that she would give birth to “the Son of the Most High” (Lk 1:32), she freely gave her consent with “the obedience of faith” (Rom 1:5). Mary thus gave herself entirely to the person and work of her Son Jesus, espousing wholeheartedly the divine will regarding salvation. ccc

The most Blessed Virgin Mary was, from the first moment of her conception, by a singular grace and privilege of almighty God and by virtue of the merits of Jesus Christ, Savior of the human race, preserved immune from all stain of original sin. 135

492 The “splendor of an entirely unique holiness” by which Mary is “enriched from the first instant of her conception” comes wholly from Christ: she is “redeemed, in a more exalted fashion, by reason of the merits of her Son”. 136 The Father blessed Mary more than any other created person “in Christ with every spiritual blessing in the heavenly places” and chose her “in Christ before the foundation of the world, to be holy and blameless before him in love”.

Pax

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What do you mean by “omni-logical”? ‘Logical’ is not an umbrella-term for all terms.

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He created his own Web Site and Religion the link is in his post above its filled with the same nonsense.

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What are you doing is this…you are living within a self-made way of understanding who or what God is and then forming a narrative from events manifesting in Scripture according to your concept.

This is confirmation-bias. You have started with a premise and then formed a narrative from the foundation which you have built. And then having stuck with it, have kept with it for so long that you have moved away from the point of questioning your own ideas.

The point here is that in Genesis, God answers Moses with, “I Am Who I Am”. This is an answer which leaves an open-ended conclusion as is it is for Moses to ponder and to be given knowledge of this understanding over time as knowledge of God can only be ‘revealed’ (as God is God) and must also be in a relational capacity between said-worshipper and God for the worshipper to begin to try and fathom who is God is; otherwise, for God to expound an in-depth explanation would be tantamount to giving Moses a book to read rather than for him to…live…in a growing understanding of and trust in…who God is.

‘I Am Who I Am’, as an answer, does in fact , in itself reveal / give an idea…as to the immensity of God as the Alpha and Omega and that summing Him up with labels will only in the long-term undermine rather than in some manner serve to form Moses’ journey of learning and imbue trust.

The reality of God for Creation is lived worship. And this can only be understood, once you’re living along that path. God does give Moses the Commandments and orders to carry out and in Scripture God reveals aspects of Himself to the prophets as they come to know Him.

A lived knowledge of God, is worship, and only in relation to the true God as opposed to a false idol. Only a person who is living in worship of the true God can be imparted with knowledge of God and only such a person would want to worship God because God is not a dictator (such as the gods of other world ‘religions’).

There was a book called, ‘The God of Surprises’, written by Gerard W. Hughes, and I would recommend it. A God who is answerable to an umbrella-term is a product of our own making (of the human mind) as we cannot truly, as created beings, fathom that which is unfathomable.

Therefore, it appears that you wish to put God into a compartment so that you can feel that you understand who or what He is at the outset.

I’m not going to leave the matter here, either, because I wish to take your own words further in debate as you keep using 'Logic as an explanation.

Logic is within the subject-framework of mathematics and a subset area of reasoning. You never watched Star Trek? God is Dr. Spock? Because there are a whole bunch of characters in those episodes and one might assume that they would all exist within one God who could understand all of them rather than God living within just one of the characters and indeed one which can only calculate (like Ai) what it is like to feel an emotion.

If your foundation for understanding was to be formed on a definition consisting of God meaning God as ‘the Creator’ then you would surely see that calling God ‘Logic’ is to only give rise to one aspect of Him. Many instances in life are not logical and yet are the right ones, when taking into account a…whole…situation. Maybe you became unstuck with ‘The Matrix’ and never moved on?

Only a robot-god could be omni-logical, as the first premise. And I don’t worship Panasonic.

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I think what I am saying, however, is that you are putting a label on God as a title and summing Him up as a first-premise logical source rather than Logic being one aspect of Him.

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God encompasses the subject of Logic and which you are using in an non-definable way and therefore are really using a different term other than Logic. The Church says ‘faith and reason’ are a means to opening the door of one’s mind and heart to the reality of the triune God. I would also suggest, and which might be a small step for you to place yourself onto, a path of thinking which is ‘objectivity’. The difference between the subjective and objective. Also, approaching the subject of mystery (the ‘mystical’) and what Mystery means in relation to the reality of the triune God.

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It’s the word, ‘logic’, which doesn’t sit well. Instead of saying “…in knowledge of God as we would understand, it would seem logical to believe in God”, you are saying “God IS Logic”. But are you saying…”within…God is Logic” or “logic sums up who God is”? Just wondering whether you are talking cross-purposes with everyone due to sentence-structuring and terminology-usage.

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Christ is God’s Word and which is infinite Wisdom, not Logic. Logic is superceded by (eternal) Wisdom. As said, you are indulging in confirmation-bias. It comes from not actually reading Scripture and instead forming your own concepts.

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…A different religion, as someone else said, if you believe that.

Also, St. Paul was given to “understand” by the Holy Spirit - as appointed by Christ.

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Would you highlight references as references when you are citing passages of the Catechism or from wherever derived…just put the reference in brackets after the quote or write it underneath the cited paragraph and which you should put in single quotation-marks and / or in italics.

You haven’t actually responded to my question concerned with your usage of the word ‘logic’ and whether you are summing God up as pure Logic with the idea that God is a sort of Divine Logic or whether you are simply saying it is logical to believe in God.

The word ‘logic’ used to state that God gave us a path of logic to follow and which itself leads to the Holy Mysteries is not at all found in Scripture as true and probably because it isn’t; and also, it doesn’t whatsoever make any sense.

How can logic lead to mystery. They are two polar ends of a spectrum.

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Logical intelligence doesn’t, as an umbrella-explanation, satisfy the demands of a Creation in requirement of Love. And not a love which is emotively-driven or even naturally-motivated, but which is sacrificial, and which is not logical at all - as we are to understand the term, ‘logic’.

An Empire is lorded over, by dictatorial means, as won by conquest. Try another word to mean what you mean - ‘kingdom’, for example.

From the beginning of our debate, you still haven’t nudged me on beyond thinking that your premise for a god is ‘The Fifth Element’.

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That’s one aspect of God. A mathematical answer might be that it was logical or even mathematically symbiotic or ‘balancing’ to do what God did in sacrificing His only Son. Yet, all of that is not coming from a single source of Logic as if God is a computer. Logic and Maths are both a part of God. God encompasses those branching aspects. They are a part of His Creation. Like building-blocks. And reason is of God. And Love and Wisdom. Wisdom surpasses logic in terms of a rounded hierarchy of knowledge. To reference, mixing contexts, St. Paul said that “…the greatest of these is love”. This is why he goes as far as to say “God is Love”. Not that God can be summed-up even with that word but that Love is not just a feeling attributed to God and is rather in entirety of understanding solely…God. You would be referring at best to the practical explanations behind the manifestation of God in trying to point to the Whole, but which you can’t, anyway, because God is Mystery. You cannot truly fathom the triune God. It bugs you. But you can’t. And logic most certainly falls far short as an umbrella-term.

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…And if logic as a subject cannot explain in entirety the creation of all which the universe holds, then how do you suppose it is any different in Heaven. That on an Eternal level there is some different kind of logic. Then humanity is stumped because if it is through faith and reason that we can come to know of God then if these terms all mean something alien somewhere else then we will never know anything. It would be like being given Greek words to learn Italian.