(P1) Cardinal Bugnini was the primary architect or the Novus Ordo,
(P2) Him and 6 Protestants created the Novus Ordo,
(C) Therefore the Novus Ordo is intrinsicslly Protestant in nature.
It was created because the mass of Pius V was “too Catholic”.
The actual controversy that Jesus deals with has to do with the purpose of the Law of Moses. What is the intention of the Hebrew worship system, the Hebrew temple religion? What is the purpose of that teaching in the Old Testament? The Hebrews who opposed Jesus believed that the system of religion established by Moses in the Bible was to be maintained for all time, that it was the way of salvation. They believed salvation was only available to Hebrew people because only Hebrews followed the Law of Moses and worshiped God as commanded by the Law of Moses. Only Hebrews could be saved and have a relationship with God, but only if they entered into the Hebrew system of religion, starting with circumcision.
Circumcision was the law of the covenant of Abraham, and it was equivalent to what Christians would find in baptism. For a Hebrew living according to the Law of Moses, step one was circumcision. This became a problem if you were a Roman or a Greek.
Peace to all,
So true, nuncincipio, To me OMNILogically, “Too Catholic” is logically for all who understands the Two Nature God of Abraham becoming again in all One Family and is what the God of Abraham promises, eternal life in two natures, becoming Baptized in One Body in all becoming in all from Sacrifice through Penance, forgiven in all becoming again in One Divine Spirit Family One God in being, OMNILogically, I believe.
To me logically, the two natures, spirit and life becoming together in One Body is what is not rationally understood by so many. All mankind logically becomes in all in One Body through two natures from the spirit through the created souls of all for the flesh through The Christ uniting spirit and life in all becoming in One Body becoming again In all One Divine Spirit Family One God in being, in all generalizations logically, I believe.
The Hebrews were “picked” to carried the “Chosen” Living Sacrifice of Animals with them from Egypt to The Promiseland in the Ark of The Old Covenant, saving the spirits in the souls to the Bosom of Abraham awaiting the Christ in the good works of the flesh becoming in all One Body through both natures, God and Temple, Spirit and Life becoming again in all One Divine Spirit Family One God in being, in all rationality, I believe.
Catholics understand the Sacraments from death to life are Baptism and Penance through Sacrifice becoming again in all through both natures respectively, Spirit and Life, God and Temple, becoming in One Body through the Christ in all mankind becoming again in all One Divine Spirit Family One God in being, in all generalizations, I Believe.
Logically the God from the Faith of Abraham is The God of Two natures, Spirit and Life, God and Temple, becoming again in all One Divine Spirit Family One God in being, rationally and in all generalizations.
Old Covenant Salvation is Circumcision of the flesh through The “Chosen” Living Sacrifice of Animals and forgiven to save the one nature spirit in the Bosom of Abraham, New Covenant Salvation is Baptism from the spirit through the souls of all for the flesh in One Body in all from the fulfilled faith and morality in all through The Christ, The “Chosen” New Living Sacrifice in The Host through Penance becoming forgiven in both natures becoming again in all One Divine Spirit Family One God in being, to me, I believe.
Peace always,
Stephen
Sounds like an over-simplification. Do you have any evidence to back up your claims? I’m not saying that you are wrong, but it sounds a little presumptuous.
“ On 3 April 1969, Pope Paul VI published the apostolic constitution Missale Romanum, with which he brought radical changes to the way of celebrating the Mass. One of the architects of the liturgical reform was Monsignor Annibale Bugnini and six Protestant pastors also took part in it, including Max Thurian of the Taizé Community, who declared: One of the fruits of the new Ordo will perhaps be that non-Catholic communities will be able to celebrate the Holy Supper with the same prayers as the Catholic Church. Theologically it is possible.” Source:Breve esame critico del Novus Ordo Missae - Wikipedia
Yes sir, it is an “over simplification” of course. They wanted to be able to attract Protestants, so they ended up “Protestantising” the liturgy. And to help them, they got 6 Protestant “experts”. The only explanation for why they got 6 Protestants to help create the liturgy is that Paul VI et al. wanted to make the Mass more Protestant.
Peace to all,
To me logically once the protests stops it will return from where it came, back to the Teaching Church in the New Eve becoming through Jesus in the New Adam becoming the Christ in all mankind becoming again in all One Holy Spirit Family One God in being, in all generalizations.
Somewhere I think The angels were told of the becoming power of flesh through the Christ, becoming in all mankind and how mankind saves the angels, everything becoming again one holy family.
To me, Perfecting what is derived from infinite wisdom is understanding from three Gods and personal Powers in being preexisting before all creation was even created all mankind and angels are created from The Father failed through two natures becoming transformed through The New Eve glorifed through the Queen of Heaven’s immaculate flesh becoming Holy Spirit incorruption for Jesus in the New Adam becoming the Christ in all mankind becoming again in all One Holy Spirit Family through all of the logical formulas of the Wondrous Mysteries of the Catholic Faith, I believe OMNILogically.
And rationally we all know not to preach or proselytize but to just generalize for all from the Faith of Abraham for all becoming again in all One Holy Family, I believe,
To me rationally nothing is removed from the Old Covenant Sacrificial and Penitential feature benefits of salvation and only fulfilled through two natures, Spirit and life, in all from the feature benefits of “The Gift” becoming again in all through two natures in One Body becoming again in all One Holy Family of God, I believe.
To me the logical formulas of the Faith form Abraham are fulfilled, Baptized becoming transformed flesh immortality from the New Eve for Jesus Virgin Born becoming The New Adam through The Christ in all mankind from Holy Spirit incorruption through Sacrifice for Penance forgiven from the good works of the flesh through the Power of the Holy Spirit for the Body from two natures from rebirth through salvation becoming again immortally transformed and incorruptibly transfigured becoming again One Holy Spirit Family One God in being.
Theologically, rationally, OMNILogically? How Does the
New Eve do it?
Logically, Co-Redemption is from Mary through the New Eve for Jesus becoming Virgin Born from New Eve immaculate immortality through the New Adam in Holy Spirit incorruption becoming The Christ in all mankind becoming again One Holy Spirit Family One God in being in all becoming again in One Family of God,
To me in all generalizations, Born again is Baptized “reborn” in The New Eve transformed through the Immaculate Conception and “saved” is logically from Sacrifice through the New Adam becoming The Christ in all “saved” reimaged through the Christ in all through Penance becoming forgiven in all and faithfully from all of the Wondrous Mysteries of The One Holy Catholic and Apostolic Faith becoming in all immortally glorified and incorruptibly transfigured becoming again in all One Holy Spirit Family One God in being in all generalizations, I believe.
Peace always,
Stephen
Spirit and life are a single nature as shown by Saint Ambrose of Milan: “And so these three witnesses are one, as John said: The water, the blood, and the Spirit [1 Jn. 5:8]. One in the mystery, not in nature. The water, then, is a witness of burial, the blood is a witness of death, the Spirit is a witness of life. If, then, there be any grace in the water, it is not from the nature of water, but from the presence of the Holy Spirit.” - De Spiritu Sancto, 77
Life simply is the Spirit, for God is Life (John 14:6).
May the Lord’s countenance be upon you.
I believe Co-Redemptrix is a blasphemous term that should never be used. Co=with, redemptrix=(female) redeemer. Thus to say “co-redemptrix” is to call our mother “redeemer with Christ” which is utterly blasphemous and disgusting. Only Christ may redeem us for He is God, and His blood is precious enough to be a worthy oblation. Our lady is merely the ark, and indeed the most holy vessel by which God came. Moreover a vessel for our prayers also. I honor our lady greatly, and I love her second to our God (Whom ought to be loved with an attempted infinite love), I love her on the same level as my true mother, or perhaps even more than my true mother, but I shall never call her co-redemptrix. She was not the one who bought us back on the cross, nor was she on the cross next to Christ, nor would she have been a worthy ablation on her own.
May the Lord’s countenance be upon you.
For me, the most important point is that the Novus Ordo Mass is valid.
Jesus promised, “behold I am with you always until the end of the age”. I take from it, that he has promised never to abandon his cihurch. This should give us a lot of hope 
The point is that people have abandoned Him and His Body and His teachings by these novelties. Here is my YouTube channel explaining things like the Vatican II, heretical understanding of ecclesiological incorporation, etc: https://youtube.com/@nuncincipioprochristo?si=lIe-MmkW6AeQKmOA
May the Lord’s countenance be upon you.
Peace to all,
All Forefathers of the Trinity all missed the logic not seing the Mother of God preexisting together with the Father and The Son in One Holy Sprit Family One God in being becoming again in all through the Christ One Holy Family through two natures, in all generalizations, I believe.
From the Spirit through the life becomes in One Body from two natures, Spirit and flesh, God and Temple in Oen Body throuigh the Christ, becoming again in all One Holy Spirit Family One God in being, OMNILogically, I believe.
The Christ is logicaly The Father the Son and The Mother conceived through the Flesh of Jesus becoming The Christ in all becoming again in all One Holy Spirit Family in two natures, Spirit and life in One Family of God in being.
To me, logically the Christ is Jesus conceived by the Power of the Holy Spirit Family One God in being becoming in all mankind through the Christ in all becoming again One Holy Spirit Family one God in being, OMNILogically, I believe.
Peadce always,
Stephen
I apologise for probably not being able to understand your writing enough, but are you saying that our lady pre-existed with the Father and the Son?
Peace to all,
We are not arguing what the Church says Faithfully, as also bound in Heaven, just the logic in generalization for all.
Logically Mary is a God, Queen of Heaven, The New Eve, Our Sister from the Holy Spirit and Our Mother through The Immaculate Flesh becoming again in all Jesus. And logically, The Holy Spirit is The Famiy of God becoming again in all One God in being, I believe, in all rationalization and Faith.
So true, nuncinpio, and we all know this is not a me thing, OMNILogic is an us thing for all becoming again One Holy Family. OMNILogically we know the Mother of God is always together with the Father and the Son in infallible intelligence logic unfailing preexisting from three powers and personal Gods in being in One Holy Spirit Family becoming to earth and living inside of us through the flesh of Jesus, The New Adam becoming The Christ in all becoming again One Holy Family One God in being in all generalizations, I believe.
Peace always,
Stephen
Are you saying that our lady is eternal? I’m truly curious, I just cannot understand your posts very well.
Peace to all,
True, nuncincipio, Mary is God of Mercy, God of Transformation becoming the New Eve at the Annunciation sanctified from Holy Spirit incorruption though Mary’s soul for The Immaculate Conception and First Christ on earth for the Virgin Birth of Jesus becoming The First Born Christ of all creation Reborn to Heaven for all mankind in 0 A.D. latin for The Year of The Lord(s), Mary and Jesus through The Christ’s in all mankind becoming again. and the beginning of Church time on earth, as I believe, in all generalization.
Peace alwyas,
Stephen
Did Adam and Eve disobey God or did only Adam? Adam is to blame, because God told him and not Eve not to eat of the tree of knowledge of good and evil, and Eve played a role.
Likewise, Jesus (the new Adam) is the One who redeemed the world by His obedience and Sacrifice to the Father, and Mary played a part in it.
I get your point about the literal translation. Would it be more appropriate to drop the “trix” for “or”? I would think this would be equally flawed, because that could imply Mary was a male or that she equally played a part (which she did not).
I’m fine with the term. We just need to be clear about what we mean by it and what we do not mean by it. Jesus is the Sacrificial Lamb. Mary is not. Jesus is God. Mary is not. Adam and Eve disobeyed God. Mary and Jesus obeyed God.
Explain how our lady is co-redemptrix
I thought I just did.
You said that she had a significant role in bringing about the redeemer (and thus redemption), but you never explained how she’s “co-redemptrix”
If you and another guy start a company. He does most the work, but you play an important part. You are called a co-founder. It dose not imply that you played an equal part in the company. If think that to the modern individual, they hear equal to when they hear co.
Communion has the prefix co. We are in Communion with God, but it does not mean that we are equal to God.
Protestants think that Mary takes away from Jesus, but in actuality, she magnifies our Lord. Just like if I start a company with someone, I do not take away from what the founder is doing, I contribute to it. And I point to the founder and what he has done.
I’m not calling you a Protestant, but I am suggesting that maybe your understanding of Mary as co-redemptrix is similar to how Protestants misunderstand what we mean by it.
I disagree with this because she’s not “redemptrix” in the first place. She places a role in our temptation through Christ, but not in the slightest way does she actually play a role in redeeming us herself.