Bob's Burgers or The Simpsons?

General
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$100 for hearing God’s name used in vain, much of the time. There is some quality substance out there, however. Down to personal choice.

Actually, a side point we pay £16 a month ($23) to watch free channels plus phone included. A streaming subscription would cost over-and-above, let’s say £7 ($9.50) as an average. If we wanted to watch programmes in 4K resolution then the line would possibly have to be broadband (prior to further experimentation with sim-powered devices). I’ve paid the same for twelve years with no deterioration of service. It is possible I could get the devices to work for 4K without broadband and instead with use of advanced routers, extra antennas and super-fast ethernet cabling. I can watch 4K now but with some interruption; uninterrupted, at around 2K - it’s definitely HD, over 2K probably. Some subscription channels boast 4K, while I think they are down-sampling from 4K as I can watch them without interruption, YouTube at 4K sometimes incurring interruption and the platform I go by as a test for picture resolution.

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Greetings Morgan!

I can see that you and I could go on discussing for hours. You have a wonderful mind. And it seems that you are not completely bound up in dogmatic conceptions…although you may perhaps have a few…other wise how could you be a Catholic (which I am asuming you are).

I have looked up a some words pertaining to our conversation on AI:

“Monasticism is a religious way of life that involves renouncing worldly pursuits to devote oneself entirely to spiritual work. Practitioners, such as monks and nuns, typically live a highly disciplined, often ascetic existence either in isolated solitude or within a shared religious community.”

“In the Catholic Church, the eremitic life is recognized as a form of consecrated life, where individuals publicly profess vows to live in the silence of solitude”."

TV or not TV…for me it is because I feel that there is so much content that is not conducive to prayer and worship…which I am desiring to be the fabric of my life…therefore I avoid the TV…in large part because I am not advanced spiritually, and this medium can be adictive for someone like myself…which I consider to be a kind of contamination of the spirit. I don’t imagin that Jesus and his disciples would spend much time watching vidoes on TV.
Yes, God must have a sense of humor. In the ancient classical Vedic literatures, writtn in the Sanskrit language, the definition of “the Absolute Truth” is that it is the source from which all manifestation emanates. In other words, everything in existence comes from God, otherwise it would not exist. If it exists, it must exist within God …as the source. Therefore God must have a sense of humor.

Yes, having a TV “might be considered as letting the world in.” But with freedom of choice comes responsibility. According to scripture, Adam and Eve exercised freedom of choice, and the result was deportation from the Garden of Eden. My conviction is that this narrative is metaphorical. No such garden will be found on this planet by archeologists. But the narrative is profound. By choosing to act in contradiction to the advice of God, we find ourselves in separation rather than in communion. According to the Vedic literature, the Garden of Eden is the spiritual realm, which is our real home…and we, in the material realm, are the minority group, who have made the unwise choice of living outside of God’s jurisdiction or loving exchange with us. We want to experience the fruit of the tree of “good and evil”, or what we call duality…against the advice of God. And therefore we find ourselves here, toiling and earning our maintenance by the sweat of our brow. But I understand that Catholics choose to blame this on Adam and Eve, and say that the “original sin” was not ours.
According to scripture (s), the soul is eternal…no birth, no death. But because we live (in the material dimension) inside material bodies, we are forced to experience birth and death.
The idea of spiritual life is to arrive at the revelation that “I am not this body.”, at which time one becomes fearless, understanding, as Jesus says, “I am in this world, but I am not of this world.”

The idea presented by spiritual teachers including Jesus, is that the purpose of human life is to qualify ourselves for living in communion with God. And the qualification, or cover charge, for entering into communion is to “love the Lord thy God with all of they heart and all of they strength.”…which of course puts video entertainment on the back burner.

Eating meat. I know people who weep when their dog or cat dies. The animals that we eat experience more pain in cattle trucks and slaughter houses than our cats and dogs. But the average meat eater doesn’t give this a second thought. It doesn’t occur to apply the instruction, “Do unto others as you would have them do unto you.” to animals. But if someone kicks their dog they can become very angry and upset. This kind of “disconnect” is astounding to me.

The idea, according to Vedic literature is that in animals, plants, birds, fish, reptiles, the spirit is the same. But perception and thinking capacity is a function of the “software” (the mind) that is supplied to each species.
You say that, “humans can be willfully vile.” The reason for “the fall” is the desire have the position of God, to be worshipped, to have power as far as possible, to be in control as much as possible, and to be the enjoyer of our efforts (as opposed to wishing to increase the pleasure of God through every throught, word and deed). This desire to be like God…puts us all in competition for that position. Therefore, man to man, society to society, race to race, country to country…always fighting, always wars, always imperialism, slavery, etc. And all of this is most often done in the name of God. “For God and the Queen!” In this way, people are wiling to die for their country, while the man in charge sits comfortably in his office. In other words, God deflects our sense of competition with Him, by allowing us to express it towards each other. Then He watches, while asking, “Are we having fun yet?” And from time to time He sends a teacher to the insane asylum (called the material creation) to offer us an alternative approach to life.

Meat is carcinogenic. This is understood by science today. Vedic literature states that the man who eats animals has his spiritual intelligence stunted as a result. I believe that the Essenes, who were the early followers of Christ were vegetarians. Then the Catholic church had these groups burnt alive over the centuries, by the thousands, in great piles of tree trunks. All in the name of service to Jesus.
You may say, that the idea that love of God is new-age thinking. But This is the statement of Jesus. he said, “Keep your religion and your rules. I didn’t come to change anything, but try to cultivate love for the Lord, with all of your heart.” When we love someone, we can’t stop thinking about them, 7/24. And all we wish to do it to be a source of pleasure to them. This is love of God. Spontaneously…which is dead in most of us, even though we have received some water poured over our head. In other words, most of us have hardly begun. Therefore we look for entertainment in cartoon vidoes.

I believe Jesus says in the Bible, “There is so much more that I can tell you (about the real nature of things), but you are not ready to hear of such things yet.” In other words, Jesus is teaching the kindergarten level of spiritual life.

The Catholic church has hardly any knowledge of God. What is His appearance? What is His personality? How does he dress? How does He enjoy His realtionships with the “heavenly host” in the spiritual realm? These are very personal aspects of God. The church says that God has no crown and no throne…the church has turned God into a mysterious force…a force that we can turn to when we have a personal requests for health, wealth, etc. “Love of God” is an empty slogan. Obedience is presented as some kind of ticket for earning rewards. All of this is very superficial. One is content to consier himself to a “member”, and go to chruch on Sunday for an hour or so, and go home and watch videos, or go to bars looking for …then go to confession. But as long as love of God is foreign to our heart…their wll be no change in our nature. And when there is love for God in our heart…the things of this world…we see them as empty, insignificant…we take what little we require for keeping body and soul together…and find our joy in communion. As Jesus said to the wealthy young man who came to him for spiritual advice: “Sell everything. Give it all away. Give the money to the poor. And come and be with me.” But the man couldn’t do it. And Jesus said that it is more difficult for the man with material attachments to know God, than it is to put a camel through the eye of a needle. But I do not see or hear that the Catholic church is representing Jesus in this way.

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@Peter1 If you believe animals have souls like humans do, what are your thoughts on the needless and intense suffering that animals experience in nature? I have seen this as an argument against God being “all loving”, etc.

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From my understanding, people suffer more than animals in nature. Just look up on line what percentage of adults are seeing therapists for emotional difficulty. How many suicides there are per year in each country. How many people live ther lives in penetentiaries. Car accidents, cancer, so many diseases.
The animals live simple lives: eating, sleeping, defense, and mating. Humans do the same thing. But their eating, sleeping, defending and mating are unlimitedly complex. A man needs a bed (some cost a few thousand dollars). A creature lies down on the earth. Everything we do is so complex. Look at our defense programs: insurance on house, on car, on health. And guns and bombs. For animals, mating is simple. For a man, he needs 20 years of education, a career or job, a bank account, then a vehicle, then a beautiful house ( or skyscraper building) …all so he can capture a beautiful woman. So much complexity, just to have a mate and procreate. And eating…so much preparation, dishes, cultlery, shopping. And the animal eats from the field or the tree, or catch some prey. The human life is tremendously complex and difficult. People work at jobs they don’t like, standing 8 hours a day at a cash register, just to put food on the table. And humans are always in wars, getting killed, or coming home without arms or legs, to their families.

Yes, God is all-loving. But we are endlessly building the “tower of Babel”. Always at war. Can you go to sleep at night without locking your car, and then your front door, for fear of thieves? Is this way of living pleasant…seeing our fellow man as a threat to our existence? Why are people learning martial arts? Why is it highly regarded that one man can defeat another man with kicks and blows? Then there is slavery. And sex trafficking. And people in factories who can’t get paid enough to feed their families, while other are millionaires. Do you think humans live nice lives?
God’s love is that He maintains us inspite of the fact that we hardly think of Him with gratitude. God’s love is that He sends His intimate associates to this planet to tell us that our real satisfaction is to be had in cultivation of love for God…and usually we kill them.
God’s love is that He makes this world a place of suffering, just to break down our false pride, so that we can become willing to hear the word of scripture. Suffering is our therapy. There are so many species of life…and we have lived in all of these species…until we come to the human form, in which we can understand that we need God in our life. God puts us through all of this for our redemption. Because the material world is God’s insane asylum for those souls who have turned their back on God (Garden of Eden idea). And He puts us here where we suffer, just to put some sense into us. But He let’s us have free will, to choose…God or mammon.
We are no better off than the animals of the earth. Birth, old age, disease and death. No one wants old age, disease and death…but no one can prevent it…as long as we live outside of the Garden of Eden…as long as we live in material bodies.
In the spiritual world, no one has a material body. The material body is the source of unlimited suffering. Suffering is the cure for the rebellious soul. God supplies all of our suffering…because He loves us, and wants us to come home again. We are all “prodigal sons and daughters”.
A word to the wise is sufficient. But most of us are not wise. We need more therapy. Our therapy is suffering. Therefore God supplies suffering. Because He loves us and wants us to come back home to Him. But we want to make this place of suffering into something nice. Just like hard core prisoners in jails. They are not thinking how to qualify for getting out. They thinking how to make a nice arrangment for themelves in the prison house. We are like that…trying to make life in the material world nice, instead of thinking how to qualify for returning to our real home…back to the “Garden of Eden.”

What is this body made of? Can. you take a shovel full of earth and water, and make it conscious? Can cement and iron be made conscious? We are not material. We are spirit souls. Eternal souls. But we are inside this material form. As long as we are inside, it looks alive. But it is dead matter. It only looks alive because the spirit soul is inside. And when the spirit soul leaves this body…no one wants to hug and kiss it. It is dead matter. The first basic understanding of spiritual life, religious life, is: “I am not this body. I am eternal spirit.” Are you getting this education when you go to church? Basic education. All hard work…for glorifaction of a dead body…that will end up as ashes, earth or stool. If it is burned, it becomes ashes. If it is put in nature to compost, it becomes earth. If it is eaten by animals, it becomes fecal matter. And we are spending our energy decorating this body, this body that gives us an opportunity to cultivate a relationship with God.

Do you think they need air conditioning in heaven? Do they need vaccines? Do the need cars? machines? Insurance policies? Dentists drilling teeth? And you think animals are suffering, and we aren’t? Yes, God is “all loving”…but we are too much like the animals. We are trying to make this miserable existence into the Garden of Eden…instead of trying to understand how to qualify for returning back to our real home. But no one is telling you this. They are asking you which nonsense videos you like to watch. Because misery loves company. They don’t want you to become free. “Stay with us and watch videos, and wait for old age, disease a death. Stay with us.”

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  • Nice comment. I get by. God makes up the huge deficit.
  • St. Thomas Aquinas had the gift of higher reasoning, while his pronouncement over souls is neither dogma nor doctrine.
  • I’m a Seventh Day Adventist here to have my faith enlightened by those whom I hope will lead me onto a Catholic path (I was converted to SDA by Lee Childs).
  • Never use Ai for your thinking. Or, if you do then don’t admit it. Microsoft are clever
  • …Jerks.
  • Freedom of Choice is a term not denoting a position of neutrality, personal choice is.
  • It is a blasphemy with the CC to believe that the material world is inherently evil. Adam and Eve did not choose the material world over God. They weren’t spirits.
  • Catholics believe that from the time of conception, souls are eternal. Except that of Our Lady who was as a conception always in the Will of God. But that’s another conversation.
  • Religious are in imitation of Christ’s life and they might watch the odd film. The media is just another resource. They might, however, choose to remain without entertainment and even news-sources. Christ would undoubtedly be with the poor, while the poor are everywhere. He is with them, now, in all the different people serving those in need. If He, Himself, were here, and someone in a state of joy wanted to sit and watch some cat video on YouTube or some comedy with Him, He might. His burden was light. We have to be careful not to put ourselves above others. But yes, He wouldn’t be idle, while we are called to be joyful and which means joining in. We are told that when more than one are gathered in His name, He is personally present. If there were let’s say four people sat around watching a Christian film and in a state of joy, and they offered this time up to God, though the occasion is not strictly prayer, He might personally be there. In other words, if you choose not to watch TV then that is your personal choice. But you omit TV out of mortification and being wary of ‘the world’ in protection of your faith and not because you deem the media to be evil in entirety, i.e. for the right reasons.
  • To sum up the rest, some understanding to do with animals and choosing selfishness over God transitions from peoples to peoples because all in their hearts are looking for love but which can become false paths due to the controversies of existence.
  • The Catholic Church didn’t murder people. Kings and queens and political leaders took advantage of the Catholic faith and did so with use of God’s name.
  • You can surely take God’s presence in your life to the max and sell your belongings and entirely follow Him. Maybe he is calling you to that. You can introduce on the other hand discipline into your own environment. Whatever you have to do to put God as first place. God meets us where we are. That man in Scripture had the opportunity to walk away from a life of earthly treasures. There was another man, though, who wished to accompany Christ but was told to go back to his community and not speak about the healing carried out for him. Whatever you undertake, prayer should come first to make sure you are discerning what it is that…God…desires for your life.
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So many wonderful topics… I feel that Seveth Day Adventists are more advanced on the path than Catholics. It’s like our school system, public education. It is all part of the same system…but there are different grades…then undergraduate…then post graduate. The Vedic literature describes in detail what goes on in the spiritual world…God’s eternal pastimes or exchange of love with His different devotees, all of whom relate to Him in different falvors of love. And what God looks like…in detail. And that everything here is nothing but an imitation of the reality. In the spiritual realm…everything is concious…the land, the trees, etc. Here, everything is made of dead matter, in imitation of the reality. Everything here is a shadow of the reality. But if there is a shadow…there must be a substance. But in this case, the shadow is gross. I think the Greeks talked about the shadows on the wall of the cave…taking them for reality. Hare Krishna! “Krishna” means that God is so beautiful, so attractive, that if one realizes Him, one can’t think of anything else. Of course I am not on that platform…I am a materialist, trying to become spiritual.

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No, Seventh Day Adventists are not more advanced. They want to blow people up. I’m Catholic.

Your explanation of the Vedic sounds extremely ungrateful.

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It’s not ungrateful. Peter and my belief system are very, very similar. He’s speaking from a higher perspective, and only those who have eyes that see and ears that hear innerstand where he’s coming from. Yes, normal everyday people will see Peter’s explanation as someone who is ungrateful because of the way he phrases things. I have found that just like you can’t take The Holy Bible verbatim (or take the Holy Bible literally all the time), the same can be said about what Peter and I believe. And it’s ok if you don’t get it, the average person doesn’t ever think from a higher perspective. To get someone to think from a higher perspective is very tough, it would be like literally starting a new life in a new town, where every single thing doesn’t make sense at first, but as you get more acquainted with how the town is run and how things are run in this new town, you very slowly become accustomed to this new way of life. Seeing things from a higher perspective requires you to think outside the parameters of your current worldview, and instead of seeing things from one angle (a.k.a. your angle) you see everything from different angles.

But even if one doesn’t practice higher perspective viewing, doesn’t matter. What matters the most in this life is how much love you gave to those around you. Peter truly means well, and I mean well too, but you can’t take everything he says as a “diss” to god. Vedic Literature, while it’s not for everyone, helps someone. Just like how Catholicism, while it’s not for everyone, will help someone.

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My comment was not clearly written: I didn’t mean that Peter1’s explanation sounded ungrateful; I meant that Vedic understanding sounds ungrateful, going by his explanation. And by that I mean that Vedic understanding sees Creation as materialistic in itself rather than materialism being an over-and-above indulgence in what is superficial. Without Genesis, understanding the fundamentals would be impossible. And these other ‘religions’ are but a mere distant envisaging, in expectation of the Incarnation.

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As said to EarthsStudent: “My comment was not clearly written: I didn’t mean that Peter1’s explanation sounded ungrateful; I meant that Vedic understanding sounds ungrateful, going by his explanation”."

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I see, well I apologize for the misinnerstanding. I obviously still have a lot of growing to do. I’m not religious, I’m Spiritual. And, while my belief system is similar to Peter’s, it’s not exactly the same, but it’s similar.

But, like I said, the main thing is the amount of love you give to others. Knowing how to think and see things from a higher perspective isn’t easy, cause it challenges you to think differently. It’s a form of critical thinking that, unless you’re able to think outside-of-the-box and have an open mind and an open heart, a lot of what you learn is odd but as you learn and grow, you start seeing the world through a very different lense. Life takes on a completely different meaning, but one in which you can see the bigger picture instead of seeing things through your own interpretation. In other words, it’s just a different way of viewing things is all.

I do, however, enjoy reading your posts Morgan. Very insightful!

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I think it best that I simply withdraw. If someone is on a spiritual journey, with devotion and faith, it is not my place to attempt to convince him to change or to adopt my perspective or understanding. Hare Krishna!

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With all due respect, that’s ‘copping out’.

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“Coping out” (often spelled “cop-out”) is an informal phrase meaning to avoid or evade a responsibility, commitment, or difficult situation. It involves taking the easy way out instead of confronting an issue head on.

If you are in love with someone, and I am in love with someone else…why should I try to convince you to love the person I love?

I believe that Jesus is sent to us by God Himself.
And I believe that Krishna is God Himself. I believe that Jesus loves Krishna, and Krishna loves Jesus. “I am my Father are one.” So I don’t see and argument. Jesus says “There is so much more that I can tell you, but you are not ready to hear of such things.” (paraphrase). The Vedic literatures describe Krishna in detail, His form, His qualities, His relationships with those who live in the spritual world, and love Him. Jesus says, “Our Father who art in heaven, Your name is holy, sacred”, and if we vibrate the sound of Your name, “Thy Kingdom come, Thy will be done, on earth as it is in heaven.” Therefore we are singing the name of Krishna congregationally. And we are repeating his name on our prayer beads, just as you have the rosery. We believe that whether we say “Allah”, or “Jehovah”, or “Krishna”…there are so many names all referring to the creator…therefore we are worshipping the same God, by a different name. I don’t see any reason to try to convince you to adopt my practice of religion…because you are already worshipping God in your own way, according to your understanding of scripture, as given to yo by your church. From my point of view, that is perfect and there is no reason to convert you, or for you to convert me.
Jesus says, “Don’t caste your pearls before swine.” He doesn’t mean to call anyone an ill name. He is simply saying that if something is precious to you, it makes no sense to present it to someone who will not or cannot appreciate what yhou have to offer. Also, they may disrespect what is dear to you, and that will only be hurtful.
I am guessing that Catholics feel that only Catholics will be recognized by God. But I do not feel that way. I feel that anyone who recognizes the creator of all that be as our loving Lord and Master…this will be noted by God, regardless of what language they use, what color of the skin, what race they are, whether they live in the jungle in the most untechnological way, or whether they carry a smart phone in thier pocket.
There are things that I would argue about. There are people on this planet, churches on this planet that believe that God is a great impersonal energy, and that we are that energy, and therefore we are God, and therefore we don’t have to worship God. I argue against that.

There are people who worship God, not because they love Him, and want to give God pleasure, but because they want something from God. Whereas Jesus teaches that if we love God, he will provide everything without being asked. Therefore I argue against placing our orders before God, and expecting Him to be our order-supplyer. Real love asks for nothing in return.

There are people who go to war against other nations because their leaders tell them this is a way to worship God. I argue against that. In America I heard the minister of defense lecture his soldiers that killing Muslims in Iran is God’s work. I argue with that.
So these are my convictions. But can I prove anything? Can you prove anything? You are already worshipping God. I am grateful to you for that. You do not have to approach God according to my scripture, and my belief. I believe that God is not pleased by us when we argue that “My way is the only way to approach God.” God is more broadminded than we can imagine. People worshipped God for thousands of years, before Jesus appeared on this planet. God has received their worship. The Jews worship God in their way, and the Christians worship God in their way. I have no doubt in my heart that God is moved by our sincerity. But this is my faith. I see no need to debate or to argue.
The burden of proof is on the practitioner. If we are sincere, God will reveal Himself to us in different ways. God appeared to Moses as a burning bush. If I want proof, I have to invoke God’s mercy on my soul. But I cannot impose my revelation on someone who doesn’t have it, or doesn’t desire it.
There is a vast difference between the believer and the atheist, those who refute the existence of God, and those who hate God. We have to avoid the atheist, because they will blaspheme. And we should not give them the opportunity to condemn the One we love. But if I love God according to my scripture, and you love Him according to yours, if we love God, and love our neighbor as we love ourselves, if we see God’s hand in all manifestation…anyone who behaves and feels in that way, I have no arguement with him. God is our eternal Father. We are all His children. We are all one family. Some recognize Him. Others are prodigal sons and daughters, loitering in the steets. God feeds us all.

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Nice of you to say. We know what we come to know, so I can’t take credit. :slightly_smiling_face:

I agree that life does bring other levels of understanding. While I would also say that, not only the rudiments, but the fundamentals remain the same. What can change is how we apply ourselves to the various intricacies.

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